Insulted by Ebonics - Do you unknowingly stereo type other people?

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Permalink Reply by Cissi Sherlock on July 6, 2009 at 11:35am

OMG!

I knew this discussion was missing something!

Hi, Nicki!

Permalink Reply by Tino Marquez Jr. on July 6, 2009 at 11:51am

It's funny to me when I hear white people trying to "talk black" or in Ebonics because they typically sound so idiotic... I'd have just laughed and let it go.

I think we need to be careful with those kind of statements. Saying it is funny when we hear white people try to "Talk black", if you reversed that and said it is funny to hear "black people talk white" or in "proper English" ... yeah, I think you see my point. If I said something similar but changed the color, I would NOT be so popular.

I do not think it is healthy to attribute certain manerisms and traits to one specific group of people then laugh at or shun another group trying to adopt those standards. For instance, some fo these white people you laugh at could be suburban-weekend-gangsta-wantabes or maybe they grew up in parts of town where everyone spoke like that, and that is all they know.

Permalink Reply by Cissi Sherlock on July 6, 2009 at 1:01pm

I've lived it. I know it.!

When I was a manager for Karma records several years ago, there was a popular song by a group called NWA.

The lyrics went a little something like this (edited, but fun to say!!!):

Here's a little somethin' bout a nigga like me
Never shoulda been let out the penitentiary
Ice Cube would like ta say
That I'm a crazy m*****a f****a from around the way
Since I was a youth, I smoked weed out
Now I'm the m****a f****a that ya read about
Takin' a life or two
That's what the hell I do, you don't like how I'm livin
Well f****k you!

That's when rap was rap! Oh, please shoot me!

As manager of the store, "wiggers" as they are called would come in singing that song and I would look at them like, "Huh? A nigga like you? But you are a....oh - ok!"

Ebonics, ebonics, ebonics.

I never heard of a song sung by a Black man that said, "... tell you a little something 'bout a White Boy like me...!" And, actually to make a point, White Boys like to be called white boys by the bruthaz (Now i'm going Lisa Lampanelli on you!). Even on the show, "I love New York" she nicknamed one of her contestants, White Boy.

What comes to mind is that Dave Chapell vignette - Clayton Bigsby, the Blind Racist.. It is very funny, but if you are offended, don't link. And, being who I am, I don't care if you are offended or not, it's just plain funny!

I like funny.

Permalink Reply by Michael R. on July 7, 2009 at 3:25am

Hey Tino, you never addressed my statements to you a few pages back.

Permalink Reply by Cissi Sherlock on July 6, 2009 at 1:35pm

I have been engrossed in a discussion about Ebonics for the last two days.

Sensitivity and political correctness seem to be a the core of this exchange.

Took a break and went to the kitchen to fix my lunch. I pick up today's newspaper to read and came across something I though was quite interesting, again approaching a topic of sensitivity and political correctness. Check it out.

This prompted me to ask two questions, therefore starting my own sp...

Permalink Reply by Johnnie Firari on July 7, 2009 at 12:22am

First glad you are doing better.

My question would be did you stereo type the male nurse as a white person who was trying to speak ebonics? Maybe this was his normal way of speaking and you instantly classified him as a "white" nurse trying to relate to you on a "black" level. I ask this because we adapt to our environment around us (how we speak, dress, facial features, etc..). The high school I went to was majority black and I was the only white student other than a female who never showed up to school. When I would speak to people over the phone, many would automatically assume I was black, not because of slang but because of the tone of my voice.

OK so lets say for argument sake he was "fake" or "a wanna be". Then why would this offend you at all. This is a reflection of that person. Unless he approached you on another level where he spoke to you like you were his "hommie" or "dog". Then maybe you would correct him by saying please do not speak to me in that manor.

Now the thing about Hilary Clinton and if if it insults you when a white person addresses you in ebonics. You have to know your audience when you are speaking to people. This does not mean you change everything about yourself or how you want to represent yourself. For example when I worked in a restaurant, I found it easier for Hispanics to understand me if I added a slightly different tone to my voice. So I could relate my message better by speaking in a slightly different tone, would that be me insulting the Hispanics? Or would that me adapting to what would best get the message across for the benefit of both parties?

Now if I walked up to two different guys on the street to ask for direction and one was younger, had tattoos and his pants sagging below his bottom and the other was older, no tattoos and well dressed. Which greeting would I use for each person? Would I say "Excuse me sir would you be so kind to tell me how to get from here to there" or "Hey, can you help with directions to get from here to there?" The test to this is did you automatically think I was describing a younger black man and an older white person? The answer, was neither black nor white, as I was merely describing a younger generation to an older generation.

Last note. I know it is not Africa but I do have a few born and raised Jamaican friends. They laugh at the whole black and white ideal in the U.S.. They are always the first to tell me, "Johnnie we are not white or black in Jamaica, we are just Jamaican". I think the separation that we create ourselves here speaking if it is black or white just still draws in the past ideals of separation. As I know past heritage is important to uphold lets put it to the side and call ourselves "Proud Americans". Saying you speak white or you speak black only allows us to justify in a conversation a difference in race, which is part of what I think people fought to overcome in the past. We are all created equal so let however someone speaks just be a clear representation of that person and not of the complete race....

Thanks,
"Let your role model be the one in the mirror"
Johnnie Firari

Permalink Reply by Victoria Finch on July 7, 2009 at 2:00am

Wow you had a lot to say. Again, I do not feel that the nurse was trying to insult me. He was merely trying to be "nice". If it makes you feel better, I feel the same way when someone shortens my name from Victoria to something else when they do not know me. It is in my opinion inappropriate to address someone in slang or in familiarity when you do not know them. As far as the black and white thing go, I went to college in Europe and many Europeans do not distinguish between black and white as we do in this country. But, they also do not share our history.
This has been a fun discussion. Thanks for participating. BTW Hilary Clinton did not offend me. We thought it was funny.

Permalink Reply by Victoria Finch on July 7, 2009 at 2:28pm

Chris I am not going to give you a history lesson, but there is no way that you can compare the slave trade in America to slaves in Europe. I don't ever remember learning in European history that people of African decent were considered to be 1/5th of a person.

Permalink Reply by Victoria Finch on July 9, 2009 at 4:15pm

First of all I was a French and Political Science major in college. I spent a year abroad in France as part of the Indiana University Overseas Study Program. I also traveled extensively while I was there. So I must correct you, I have studied their views on race relations. Not only did I study it,I lived it! In Europe its not typically your skin color that is diffrientciated but your nationality or religious beliefs. Yes, I said typically. But that is not to say that ALL Europeans diffirentiate people.

Again, I am not going to going to give you a history lesson on slavery. If you think that the slave trade in Europe, Asian, and Africa compares to that of America, you need to study some more history.

Permalink Reply by Kevin L. Johnson on July 9, 2009 at 11:00pm

My friend I don't know you. And to be honest the ebonics topic is beating a dead horse. However, I have to address this particular comment. Mistake number one. You sound as though you are minimizing the American slave trade. First of all I sincerely doubt you would state those "facts" in the face of an intelligent black man. Slavery in this country was abolished in very recent history. Black people today are still reaping the effects of that brutal time period. Please, you cannot empathize, or brush off what slavery has done and is doing to black people so easily; as you do with your almost snide remarks.

Secondly, you speak about Europe enslaving different groups through the centuries, as if Europe is the only continent capable of doing so. Nothing could be further from the truth. The history we as people are taught is from a Eurocentric point of view. It completly ignores the vast ancient empires of Africa before common history. Yes, Africa possessed other empires besides ancient Egypt. Civilization STARTED in Africa. Many European scholars know this, it is no secret. Ancient Greeks studied the ways of the Kushite, and the people of Kemet. The Ancient Greeks described the Ancient Egyptians as having black skin, and wooly hair. Their artist depict them as resembling myself. Kemetic science went beyond the physical, it was metaphysical.

I was not going to respond to your comment, but when you use words like "only" and "just" to describe slavery, it more than pisses me off. I know, you're probably tired of black people blaming everything on slavery...Hey, me too. Yeah, it's time to move on. But, understand this, and I know you've heard it before...you wouldn't understand, it's a black thing.

Permalink Reply by Kevin L. Johnson on July 10, 2009 at 10:16am

Brother Chris...Yes, you are my brother. Do you not see that if my facts are not true, then neither are yours. And yes, there is evidence that civilization did start in Africa. You can choose not to believe that. It is your choice. As I said we have a Eurocentric view of history. Our true past is kept a secret, not by accident.

Who is anyone to decide which version of slavery is worse? Anyhow, I still have love for you. The sooner we realize there is only one race, the sooner we can join the rest of the universal brotherhood, and peace that is enjoyed beyond our petty planet. It is my duty as a light worker to at least give the message of love and hope to illuminate the foolish masses in the dark.

We must prepare for the coming New Age.

I'm sorry if I hurt you by saying "it's a black thing", but I too am human, and your comments and implied remarks pissed me off. Let's us forgive each other, respect each other, and make this money y'all!

Permalink Reply by Victoria Finch on July 9, 2009 at 11:56pm

Chris,
I do not know how to begin to respond to this comment. I did not simply take a Europeon vacation.

How DARE you compare indentured servants to slaves.

Here is that history lesson that I tried not to give you. Indentured Servants voulunteered their services for passage to the New World and housing. Their "service" typically lasted for 2 to 7 years and then they were free. They were under contract. Of course, not all indentured servants came on their own free will. But the botttom line is that they were on contract and would be freed. This was not the case for African slaves.

What you know about slavery is what you have learned from your Eurocentric view of history. Have you ever read African accounts of slavery? Have you ever studied beyond what you read in "your" history books? Apparently not. Go to Conner Prarire when they have it a go through underground railroad. I think you will have a better understanding of the real story.

Did you know that African slaves often did not come directlty to this country but came by the way of South America where they were disembarked, beaten and tortured into submisison. Babies were ripped from their mother's wounds. I could go on but I won't. Get the real story before you put your foot in your mouth again.

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